Flame Point Siamese Cat

flame point siamese cat

Flame Point Siamese Cat Рphoto ©bonsaibutterfly

The photographs illustrating this post are by a Flickr photographer who lives with a fantastic looking cat who just happens to be a Flame Point Siamese. I won’t get as lucky again. The photographs are reproduced under a creative commons license.

The license permits no derivatives, no commercial work and it requires an attribution. I have complied with this. Many thanks to the photographer for granting the license.

She is talented, generous, and taken….I don’t know her name but this great cat is called Whitaker. OK down to business. There are a range of Siamese cat types as we know. Siamese cat history, charting the journey from Traditional through Classic (to me, this is the Thai cat) to Modern is interesting. Whitaker has a totally natural and gorgeous traditional appearance. You won’t get a more handsome cat. What makes him the way he is?

There is a lot of genetic work going on in a Flame point Siamese Cat. First there is the pointing. All Siamese cats have pointing. The classic is seal point, a dark brown to black pointing. The first Siamese cats to be imported into the West (the UK) were seal points. Two copies of the pointing gene (see below) makes a black cat a seal pointed cat.

The cat breeders of the cat fancy created the flame point (starting about 1948). Himalayan cats are pointed Persians, for example. You can see a flame pointed (red point) Doll Face Himalayan called Ayla by clicking on the link. Albinism is a caused by a lack of melanin pigmentation.

Pointing is partial albinism caused by the pointing gene, which affects the production of a chemical in the body called tyrosinase that in turn controls the production of melanin pigmentation. When both alleles (a pair of genes) of the pointing gene (cs) are present, pointing shows. It affects eye pigmentation too, hence Siamese cats are blue eyed.

Flame point siamese cat

Whitaker Рphoto ©bonsaibutterfly

We know how we get pointing but how does it turn orange/red in color? As I understand it (and this is a complex area) a Flame Point Siamese Cat is a red cat (or orange) carrying 2 copies (a pair) of the recessive pointing gene mentioned above. This turns the cat pure white at birth and the gene creating the red color comes through at the cooler extremities after birth as the pointing gene is heat sensitive (the extremities of a cat are cooler than the rest of the exterior of the body).

Whitaker has a ringed tail. This I believe is due to the presence of the agouti gene (tabby gene – see cat coats tabby). You can see the same pattern on the legs in the Lynx Point Siamese. His legs have faint tabby markings too. Finally, an archaic name for this cat is Flame Concha.


Sources:

  • Wikipedia
  • Showcatsonline
  • ABOUT CAT

Flame Point Siamese Cat to Traditional Siamese Cats


Comments

Flame Point Siamese Cat — 71 Comments

  1. I have a beautiful flame point cat I adopted from the humane society at five weeks old after it was found on the road alone with a sibling.He was pure white with blue eyes and to my surpise changed to the flame point. I would love to share a picture.

  2. I have a 12 year old cat named Mo, looks very similar to the cat pictured above. He is obnoxious and I adore him. We live in CA, but when we moved to CO, his coloring changed a bit – he got darker all over, he lightened up a bit after returning back to CA. I’ve never seen another cat with look as similar as the one above. Mo is a BIG cat at 16 lbs, but is actually kinda thin. oh – he also has 6 toes on each front paw. The 6th toe has a knuckle and claw and he uses it. He is a trip! Came across your page by accident as his behavior is odd lately. Looking for a page to explain his symptom.
    Very interesting read.

    • Hi, the lightening and darkening of the fur is due to the heat sensitive nature of the cells in the skin that produces the pigment that goes into the hair strand. Environmental temperature, the cooler extremities of the cat, and age of the cat affects the skin temperature. This information may help explain what is going on. Thanks for the comment.

  3. Hi, My sis have a 17 year old flame point cat named Teo, it is beautiful and talkative cat, love its to purr for everything or everyone, they live in Guadalajara, Mexico.

  4. I have a a flame point. My grand mother got her when she was weaned off her mother’s milk. At first she was solid color, then over time she got orange stripes on her tail and orange on nose and ears.

  5. Found this web page by going to orange flame point siamese cats. Interesting stories -have enjoyed all the information I found here. I just adopted an 2 Yr old Orange Flame Point, have only had him three days but he is the most loving cat- loves to be petted, and very bound to me already, and loves to talk. Got him from the local shelter. He has bright orange tip pointed ears,orange on his face,white neck and shoulders and then orange stripes all the way to end of tail, very beautiful cat – about 9-10 lbs- beautiful blue eyes and they are crossed also- but really looks like a Siamese . any more information would sure be helpful! THANKS

    • He sounds like a beautiful cat. You are lucky to have him as a companion :) As I said I think they are relatively rare cats. The CFA does not accept flame pointing as I recall. TICA accepts all pointed colors so accept the flame point. CFA = Cat Fanciers’ Association and TICA = The International Cat Association. I prefer the traditional flame point. They look beautiful to me. It seems to me that the flam point is really a red tabby point as the pointing is that if a ginger tabby cat to some extent. Although there is no M mark on the head of a flame point Siamese cat. Does you cat have an M mark on his forehead?

  6. I have a red flame Siamese named Mikey-Boy. I’ve had him since he was three months old. He is now 12 1/2 years old. I never knew a cat could be so intelligent, humorous, loyal, and lovable until this four-legged wonder walked into my life. He is my constant companion whether we are inside or outdoors. My son calls Mikey my husband. LOL The awesomeness in these cats is their coloring. In the winter, Mikey looks a deep rust, apricot. And in the summer he looks sheer cream colored. I could go on and on about these Meezers but there isn’t enough room.

  7. We had long haired flame point named Bali. Goy him at 7 weeks old and his weight was only 1/2 pound he was very sick and we nursed him back to health. He was the best cat and friend. He got out a few weeks ago and was killed by a car. He was only 2 /1/2 yrs old. My wife and daughter are devastated. We also have a grey long haired named Max that is his brother. They look and act very different. Bali was much more out going and always by our side. We are looking for another one to adopted and are having a hard time – any suggestions?

    • Very sorry to hear of your loss. Off hand I don’t know where you might adopt a flame point Siamese. As I said I think they are rare. TICA breeders are allowed to breed flame point. You might try a TICA breeder. You might go to their website and look for a breeder if you think buying from a breeder is OK. But watch out of for health. Siamese cats tend to have more health problems in my opinion.

    • I just surrendered my beloved flame tip cat, named TUCA, to our local humane society yesterday because my obnoxious neighbors couldn’t stand having him in their yard. He was a lost kitten in Brasil when he found me there 16 months ago, so I got him all fixed up with a Vet & all his Gov’t papers & brought him back to my home in the USA. Then my neighbors began threatening to call the police. He is indoor/outdoor (I have a cat door so he is free) & it would make him very unhappy to be forced to stay inside. So I released him to the Shelter, in the hope he will find a loving owner who will allow him to be free. If you are still interested, he is now up for adoption. Let me know if you want details.

      • I neglected to mention, I only released Tuca to the Humane Soc. AFTER my neighbors called Animal Control to pick him up, which they did yesterday morning. I am still very conflicted as to my feelings about what my neighbors did, & leaving TUCA at the Shelter.

    • I found a lady in Clearwater fl who had 4 kittens bought one for a friend for Christmas for 100.00 she had 3 others to sell not sure if she sold them yet Maggie 727-953-0170 was her number

    • Hi Kelly. It is pretty rare in America and Europe. You have a pretty rare cat in the USA (I presume you are American) but genetic mutations that cause short or kinked tails are not exceptional. But they are rare in the West. This cat may be a Siamese cat mix. Siamese cats in Asia sometimes have short “Manx-like” tails and kinked tails. It is part of the history of the Siamese cat breed but breeders have bred it out in the West. The word “manx” is used to mean a cat with a short or no tail but these cats are often not Manx cats at all.

  8. This picture looks like the stray intact male that is starting to call my home, his own. Although I had never seen a Flame Point Siamese, I have had the pleasure of being a childhood pet parent to a Siamese (traditional colored). I recognized the characteristics, and that is what has brought me to this page. He seems to be blind. I have never experienced a blind cat. He can look right at you and seems to only follow scents and sounds. All he wanted to do was get somewhere safe (top of closed & running washing machine) and curl up with a blanket. Thinking that he must have a home somewhere, he is not “spooked” by any sounds and loves people. I will try to find his home, would love to keep him but he needs a warm lap in a calm house, not the home of a busy 4 year old, 2 cats (altered males), and 3 various sized dogs (40, 60 & 80 lbs). I may try to get him to my vet to see if he has a micro-chip… unlikely in my area of the south, but worth a shot.

  9. I believe I have a flame point Siamese cat, but I am unsure he was a stray that wondered in and I was wondering if you could help identity the breed of my cat or anyone can help because he if a very beautiful cat

  10. My flame point Siamese adopted me about a month ago. My dog found him in an abandoned lot near my house. He was dirty and thin, but did not run away from me. I carried him home and posted his picture around, figuring someone lost a perfectly good cat. No calls, and I am glad… he is a sweetheart and a delight to talk with and there will never be a bird or stray cat coming into my yard again. I haven’t quite named him yet, just calling him cat-cat or Mr. Mrow.

  11. My flame point, Casper, is my baby. I found him in the ghetto when i was working. he was about 4 weeks and hes been with me for about 7 months. He is so amazing and has the most awesome personality. He plays fetch and rarely meows, instead he has a high pitched sort of rumble. I thought he was a mutt,then a friend who referred to herself as the crazy cat lady, lol, called it a flame point so of course i had to do some research. Origionally he was all white, i thought he was going to be a pure white cat. To m surprie he developed color onhis ears nose and tail, and very light bands around his back legs. Is there anything i should know about this breed that doesnt happen with other breeds? i.e eye problems or anything like that?

    • Hi Ashley. Casper has the Siamese gene and his pointing is red (flame). Fantastic. I would say Casper is a pretty rare cat. I don’t think he will have an special health problems. Sometimes Siamese cats can have a squint but it does not affect their eyesight. Sometimes they have kinked tails. As Casper appears not to have been bred by a breeder I would argue that he is healthier than a selectively bred cat.

      Click on the link to read about Siamese cat health problems. However that page concerns bred cats – pedigree cats. As I said I don’t think Casper is, which is a good thing because the Siamese has a long list of genetically inherited diseases. These are potential diseases depending on the individual cat.

      Thanks for visiting and asking.

  12. We have a 3.5 month old kitten “Yeti” that was born pure white, he now looks just like “Whitaker”. Beautiful cat with a very playful personality. His mother “Suki” who was also white at birth, is a seal point that is getting more and more grey with age, she is just over a year.

    • Yes, you describe a Siamese cat. All Siamese cats are born pure white and when the extremities cool the darker fur starts to grow. You are lucky. The flame point is a gorgeous looking cat. It is my favorite pointing.

  13. I have what I believe is a flame point. He was a rescue, abused, and the shelter almost didn’t bring him to the adoption drive that day. It took about six months for Ramses to adjust and come to trust me. He’s a very happy and loving cat, no longer timid or afraid, and certainly very determined to get as many scratches and cuddles from those around him!

    • Hi Terri. Thanks for visiting and showing us Ramses. He is a very handsome cat. He looks like a very classy cat with a hint of pedigree (purebred) in his appearance.

      I think he is a flame point with a bicolor coat – the pointing is interrupted by the white fur caused by the piebald gene.

      Ramses looks like a Ragdoll cat to me.

  14. My husband found this precious kitten about a month ago. He brought him home and gave him to me as a gift. He loves attention, is very sweet, gives kisses. He doesn’t meow much at all,
    I was wondering if he might be an Orange tip. I will post a pic as soon as I can.
    he has orange ears,a pale orange marking on his face,white body and orange on top of white on his tail.

  15. I have what I believe is a flame point Siamese..I’m having some trouble w/him..hes about 7mos old, he’s HUGE and is VERY vocal. We thought when he was a kitten he had separation anxiety BC he would claw at our bedroom door for hours literally screaming. Almost sounds like he’s saying “let me out” Lol. He still does it now, although not as much.

    He always wants to get outside any given chance, even though he was raised indoors. We have a lot of trouble w/him peeing on beds and.blankets. he will use the litter box, but if he’s left in any of the bedrooms, even if the doors opened, he will pee on the bed and sometimes poop on the floor. Also, he gets super angry when we vacuum. He will attack if you go near him w/the thing. Hes very playful and very affectionate, but he has a temper when he wants to. We have a puggle puppy and he LOVES to play w/her..wraps his paws around her and will roll around w/her for hours. He jumps on our counters and gets in our trash bags, seems to be obsessed w/any type of bread.

    When you don’t give him water he will push his bowl towards the sink and demand it. He sometimes uses his paws to feed himself as well. He’s starting to learn to open doors too. Oh and…aren’t cats eyes supposed to glow green in the dark? BC his glow red. The picture is him after he caught a mouse he had been hunting for over a month. BTW my 7r old named him Spike. Lol.

    • Hi Elisabeth, Spike is a flame point Siamese. He is not registered with a cat association so he is not a pedigree cat but who cares!

      His behavior (peeing etc.) indicates anxiety. I expect he does it when you or his dog friend are not around. He needs constant reassurance. He probably had a difficult start to life.

      He seems to have some Siamese characteristics too. A need for company, vocal and smart.

      Thanks for sharing.

  16. Here is a photo of our beautiful girl Mimi. We got her from a cat shelter about 2 months ago.She was found pregnant and starving, and she was little more than a baby herself. Her kittens were dead in the womb, but she now is a happy (and a bit chubby) girl who is full of affection. Pretty sure she is a red point, but no papers, of course. We don’t care… She is such a sweety, and very smart. She has learned to unlock her cat door, something neither of our two previous cats ever managed to do ;-)

    • Hi Libby she is a flame point traditional Siamese, just like the original and best type. Beautiful cat. How she ended up in a cat shelter in a bad way is beyond me. Thanks for sharing. Siamese are considered to be smart cats.

      • She is lovely. Here in Australia I think they are called red points….but there seems to be lots of debate about this. Doesn’t matter. We love her, especially when she does her happy tail wiggle when she thinks the fridge door is about to open. Cute.

  17. Here is a picture of my wonderful, sweet, intelligent six month old kitten Luna. We adopted her from someone whose orange tabby had kittens… the others were all orange tabbies! She is very vocal, social and clever — loves to play in water, will steal things and carry them around in her mouth, caught her first mouse at 10 weeks old.

    • Melissa your picture probably didn’t upload because it is over 2m bytes (too large). Try making it smaller as instructed below the comment. Thanks a lot for sharing anyway.

  18. I just adopeted a 3 year old Flamepoint, other than biteing what can I expect> just brought him home today, he picked me by reaching through the cage and grabed me. Seems a littel shy but will cuddel at his terms just like a siamese, any thing that I should know about his behavror or needs?

  19. I was given a flame point Siamese, had never heard of the breed, but I thought he was just beautiful. The lady who gave him to me did so because the neighborhood they lived in had lots of feral cats and every time Stewie went out, he was beaten up. He is now healed, and is the perfect indoor cat with no desire to go out, even though we live way out in the country and have 2 outside cats. Stewie lives with a French bulldog named Harley Davidson, a Chihuahua named Sonya, a Boston Terrier named Mitzi Lou, a Blue Heeler-huahua named Tripod, and my newest baby that I’ve had since he was 4 weeks and is now 10 weeks, named Arthur Terror (he is a terror!) but we call him Artie and he’s a toy Schnaweeniehuahua! Tripod and Stewie are Artie’s “pets” and he gives them the blues! But when Stewie is tired of the abuse, he slaps Artie off the bed, or wraps his front legs around Artie’s neck and uses his hind legs to scratch at Artie’s tummy, which is when I intervene. I’ve been rescuing animals for about 20 years, and know what Stewie is doing, so that has to be stopped. But Stewie is a “mama’s boy” and my lap is his favorite spot! (Even if he has to fight Artie for it!)

  20. The cat looking up at the camera is the same cat as the one looking out the gate. The calico is my gal Girlie, or Mama as I usually call her. She’s the most wonderful personality I’ve ever had the pleasure to know.

      • You know, I do. It’s funny you should mention it. She will lie in my arm crook, like a baby with her head in that crook and body down my forearm. She will look up at me as I talk to her. Sometimes, if she’s near, I will say something and she gives a little meow like she’s in agreement. But she will talk with her actions too. She’ll look up at me, as she sits at my feet, place her paw on my knee, then head for the back door and sit till I get up and let her out. She’s incredibly communicative, no words, but she communicates. She’s an interloper of sorts. Se showed up on my back porch one night, starving, skinny, fur all matted. I fed her and she left. Next night, she came back and ate more. I bent to pick her up and she leapt up into my arms like she belonged and she’s been here since. She’s a love..a true one.

        • Once a cat owner understands how to communicate with a cat through vocalisation, body language and routines it makes the relationship very rich and strong. I can tell you are a cat communicator ;)

  21. My Sinatra may have been a Flamepoint. He had the most beautiful eyes I ever saw. He went to Rainbow Ridge at age 16 and I still miss him.

  22. I would live to get a flame point Siamese I had a seal point and a chocolate point and they both lived till 14 yrs,
    I just love Siamese. I live in Wisc. Is there one out there for me ? I want a young one.

  23. This is my cat Myzka. I adopted him from a pet store when a women’s cat had kittens. No papers, but the vet believed he was a flame point Siamese. He is very docile, good with kids, and not violent at all. He has bright blue eyes, and tan coloring on his face and tail (although it is probably not clear in the picture). He has a favorite who he follows around and sleeps with, and loves the company of one of our older cats. He has blue eyes, and is very vocal. Is he a flame point Siamese?

    • The pointing is very subtle because the coat is peachy/tan/beige colored too slightly. I am not sure he is flame pointed. If he is he also has some white at the front of the face. That is the kind of thing that you see in mitted Ragdolls. It is probably caused by the piebald gene. He is also medium long haired.

      I tend to believe he is a dilute solid and white cat – diluted red (orange) and white but he may also be pointed as well. Certainly a melange of cat coat genes and an extremely beautiful cat.

      His coat is unique to me. I have not seen a coat like this before. He may be a flame pointed cat with other modifier genes. That is my best bet.

      Conclusion: flame point random bred cat with modifier genes to dilute (dilution gene?) and for white spotting (piebald or white spotting gene).

      Thanks for sharing. If Sarah Hartwell sees this she’ll do a better job than me because she is an expert on feline genetics.

  24. We have a Flame point Siamease and he has a Ridgeback and it is very sensitive for us to touch. Sometimes it starts Braiding. Its so cool to look at, but we can’t pet him there.

    • Are you saying that a part of his back (the spine) is sensitive to the touch. That does not surprise me to be honest. Some individual cats will be like that but the area varies somewhat. Thanks for commenting. From now on any comment you make will be published immediately.

  25. I loved learning more about flame points! I have had three cats in my life time so far. A calico, some sort of short haired tabby and my latest cat is a beautiful Flame Point Siamese named Frisco. The name describes him perfectly! Frisky + Physco = Frisco.

    He is such an amazing cat. He came into my life by mistake but I wouldn’t change a thing now. After having to put my tabby down at the age of 9 years old I went 2 years without a cat, it was hard, a home is not complete without a cat.

    Anyways I finally went down to the local SPCA and found a cat that I fell in love with named Rupert. He was a lynx point siamese. I went home to think things over before phoning and letting the shelter know that I’d be there to adopt him. However when I got there the next day they had adopted Rupert out, they had gotten him mixed up with another cat!

    I was so upset I had my heart set on a Siamese and he had been the only one. The workers saw how sad I was and went into the back and brought out this little pure while kitten with ice blue eyes. They told me that he was a siamese as well and though he wasn’t supposed to go out for adoption until the next day they would let me take him home.

    Needless to say I took the kitten home. At first I wasn’t sure i had made the right choice. This cat was crazy! He would meow constantly including that deep and loud meow Siamese seem to be known for. He would tear through the house and climb on everything! Honestly it took me a year to get used to him. I was just so used to my laid back tabby cat, I had no clue how to handle this cat.

    Thankfully though Frisco did grow on me and I finally fell in love with the little fur ball. I knew Siamese were smart but I was not prepared for how clever he can be. He soon learned were a kept his treats, learned how to open the cupboard door and rip open the bag! That was a shock to come home to all the cat treats spilled along the floor! He can turn on our drinking water tap by pushing down on the little handle and he will drink from it from time to time. He very quickly learned how to play fetch with his favourite toy as well!

    He is 2 and a half years old now and still lives up to his name. Everyday he is learning something new and always testing my patiences but honestly I wouldn’t want it any other way. I have fallen in love with the breed and would definitely adopt another Siamese in a heart beat if I saw one at the local SPCA!

    I have so many pictures of him and wouldn’t mind sharing some if you are interested in seeing them. I live in Canada so he has more orange to him then some of the others that I’ve seen, I’m assuming that that is because of the cooler climate.

    • Hi Amber, I enjoyed reading your story. It’s a lovely story and I’m pleased that you are enjoying the company of your Siamese cat. You can upload photographs to comments. If you look just below the comment box you’ll see how to do it. Please go ahead and try in another comment but if it does not work it is because the image size is too large as it is limited to 2,000,000 bytes. There are instructions also in a link which tells you how to reduce the size of the image online. It is all very easy and I look forward to seeing your photographs. Thanks sharing. Any future comments of yours will be published immediately without moderation.

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