HomeCat Behaviorchanges in behaviorAnti-spay and neuter comment “How about if we don’t try to force our opinions on others”


Anti-spay and neuter comment “How about if we don’t try to force our opinions on others” — 29 Comments

  1. Only a clueless, closed minded person would perpetuate an archaic situation like this. Stating that these cats are not pets infuriates me. They are still living, breathing souls that suffer and feel pain both physically and emotionally. This is why we need guidelines placed and enforced by our society and the government regarding the care of animals. 😥😥😥

  2. This is the very reason I despise my in laws. It’s worth mentioning they don’t believe in stifling their own breeding habits either.

  3. This is the stone cold person we so often refer to. There is no feeling or compassion or desire to improve their lives. I wonder how many kittens died from ruptured eyes and blindness. I wonder how many died being eaten alive by parasites from the inside out. I wonder how much suffering is enough suffering for a person like this. I cannot fathom a person who would feel that untold suffering and torment is a natural way of life. Disease, suffering, torment……if this is a satisfactory way to die then I hope he gives it a try and let’s us know how it works for him.

    • That’s the very same way that free roaming cats die and ALL TNR cats and ALL RTF (return to field) cats die and ALL barn-cats dumped into “barn cat programs” die. But none of you seem to care about ANY of that. Why care about it now? He’s just showing you the very same result of all your “cat saving” efforts. Talk about hypocrites living with rose-colored glasses.

      • In well managed programmes, where returned animals are re-integrated safely, the returned cats do not die. Sorry Woody, that is fact,and you won’t like that fact one bit.

        It’s a real shame that the only thing you have to offer the world is ignorance and a perverse need to fantasize about innocent animals being killed by you.

        • If they don’t die in well-managed colonies, then you’re lying that your methods reduce cat populations.

          Please explain to the class how TNR and RTF (throwing tame cats “pulled” from shelters to fend for themselves) that cat populations are reduced through your “loving and humane ‘attrition'” rose-colored-glasses method. Please list all the ways that YOUR cats die from your “loving and humane ‘attrition'”. If you won’t do it, I have about 20 methods of “loving and humane ‘attrition'” at the ready. Want me to list all the ways that you “humanely” kill cats with your “managed programmes”?

          Here’s a short-list for starters:

          1. “Natural attrition” by road-kill.
          2. “Natural attrition” by decapitation when climbing into an engine compartment for warmth.
          2. “Natural attrition” by environmental toxins.
          3. “Natural attrition” by disease.
          4. “Natural attrition” by deadly parasites.
          5. “Natural attrition” by predators.
          6. “Natural attrition” by starvation.
          7. “Natural attrition” by dehydration.
          8. “Natural attrition” by heat exhaustion.
          9. “Natural attrition” by hypothermia.
          10. “Natural attrition” by territory-fight infections.
          11. “Natural attrition” by hypoxia. (being drowned).
          12. “Natural attrition” by humans naturally hunting.
          13. “Natural attrition” by hundreds of other ways that all stray cats suffer to death.

          Want more ways that you “humanely” kill all YOUR cats?

          • Well Pretoria/Woody, since none of the ferals that I have helped care for have met an end selected from your sleazy, cat abusing fantasy list, I won’t be able to comply with your demands.

            Well and compassionately managed colonies can go on for decades. many colonies are fit, healthy and even with newcomers, can still reduce the feral population.

            Cats taken from shelters to be thrown into field? Did someone do this to a cat you once loved or is it one of your many animal abusing hobbies?

            You hate cats, but I’d put money on you hating yourself very much more.

            • Thanks for providing further proof that your methods NEVER reduce cat population, “managed colonies can go on for decades”. Again you all LIE that your methods reduce unwanted cat populations.

              What? You don’t know about the rules of RTF? And you claim to be educated in this field? Cats that are returned to shelters that are tame, but the owner fails to reclaim them, are put into RTF programs by “cat saviors”. They feel that throwing a cat out next to a freeway so the cat can find its way back to the owner is “more humane” than ending its life because some cat-owner doesn’t care enough to reclaim it in the first place or pay the fines.

              Your ignorance is highly revealing.

              • This reads like garbled nonsense to me. Actually, it has a lot of detail, maybe too much?

                Is this what you do Pretoria, adopt cats from shelters then dump them next to roads?

                Can’t say I have heard about this phenomenon happening in the UK, though we do have many abused animals in need of help.

                Perhaps it only happens in areas where you live?

        • Plain and simple: YOU and EVERYONE like you are human monsters and you must be stopped! The only ones who don’t realize that you are human monsters are you and everyone like you.

        • The reason TNR doesn’t work is the same reason T&E (euthaniasia) and T&A (‘adoption’) doesn’t work–cats reproduce far more rapidly than they can be trapped. Consider: per every ASPCA estimate I’ve seen over the last four or five years–this is usually based on a formula where there is supposedly a 1:3 ratio of unconfined cats to humans in any given area–there are on average 84.5 million stray and feral cats (range of estimates 47 million to 122 million) in the US. Add to that an average of 58 million unconfined “owned” cats (range 50 million to 66 million), 80% of which–46.6 million–are NOT sterilized.

          OK, per PRO-TNR veterinarians F. B. Nutter (no, that’s really her name) and J. K. Levy, the US feral cat population increases on average 29% per year [range 25% (Nutter, 2004) to 33% (Levy, 2003)]. That’s about 38 million new feral kittens surviving to reproduce themselves EACH and EVERY YEAR. Postulating a temperate-zone “kitten season” of about six months, to trap and sterilize, adopt or euthanize just ONE year-class of feral kittens, you would have to sterilize/adopt/euthanize 250,657 kittens a DAY. Even if by some herculean effort you could achieve this, you’d have to do it all over again very NEXT kitten season. In short, TNR or any other “passive” approach based on trapping is a MATHEMATICAL IMPOSSIBILITY.

          There is only one historically proven means of dealing with the unconfined cat scourge: active, sustained extermination. They must be hunted to extinction. Each and every one removed from our landscape–permanently.

          Firstly, all cat-feeding stations should be commandeered and re-purposed as BAITING stations. Baiting is, with very limited exceptions for brown bears in Alaska, illegal as a means of taking game in the US–because it WORKS so well. Cats are not game–they’re vermin. Station hunters with noise-suppressed firearms (or air-rifles of at least 700 fps velocity) at feeding stations, and put out the same kibble the feeders were using. Sweeten it with raw or canned sardines. Shoot every cat that comes to feed. Rinse and repeat for as long as cats continue to arrive to be fed. Incinerate all carcasses to at least 160 degrees F to destroy the parasites and pathogens they carry. THIS is how you get the so-called “vacuum effect” to work for the public good.

          Hunters should be encouraged with reasonably attractive bounties. Think this won’t work? Wolves were exterminated in the lower 48 states (AK wasn’t a state at the time) in just seven years–1880-87–after the US govt. put a bounty on ’em. This was misdirected with respect to wolves (at least to the degree it was implemented). It wouldn’t be misdirected if applied to cats, no more than it would be for eradication of invasive Burmese pythons, feral hogs, Norway and black rats or any other deleterious invasive species.

          Unconfined cats must be outlawed–in fact, in most states they are. It’s just not enforced. Per Alaska Administrative Code Chapt 5.92.029, it’s illegal to maintain unconfined domesticated animals, and legal to shoot them in self-defense, defense of property, or if they’re seen harassing or harming native wildlife. If you consider the diseases with which cats contaminate our environment, the above-cited law applies to cats in every respect.

          Onerous fines must be levied against violators, along with confiscation and euthanasia of their animals, and legal prohibition of animal ownership for repeat offenders. And in some particularly vulnerable areas, such as Hawaii, the Florida Keys, the Galapagos, New Zealand and Australia, ownership of cats must be outlawed–period–just as ownership of snakes is outlawed in Hawaii today.

          Sustained eradication is the only thing that will work. The consequences of not doing this, and doing it successfully, may well be mass extinction-induced ecological collapse and/or cat-vectored disease pandemics.

          • “The reason TNR doesn’t work is the same reason T&E (euthaniasia) and T&A (‘adoption’) doesn’t work–cats reproduce far more rapidly than they can be trapped.”

            That is a big statement. And I don’t think it is useful or verified. Firstly, TNR does work at a local level e.g. for a specific cat colony it stabilises and slowly reduces the population. I have real examples to support that. But nationwide it does not work because it is not carried out widely enough and with enough funding.

            Anyway it is not meant to be the ‘solution’ to unwanted cats. It is one string to the bow. The best solution is improving cat ownership. There has to be much tougher demands placed on cat owners in my view.

            “Cats are not game–they’re vermin. Station hunters with noise-suppressed firearms (or air-rifles of at least 700 fps velocity) at feeding stations, and put out the same kibble the feeders were using. Sweeten it with raw or canned sardines. Shoot every cat that comes to feed.”

            You are advocating multiple crimes. And you’ll be sued by cat owners for compensation. Cats are not vermin and because you describe cats as vermin I will have to ban you. You’re too angry and biased. You are a genuine cat hater. And you probably are male not female. Leave this site and don’t come back.

            • Again, it’s not illegal to destroy stray and feral cats in my state. They’re officially recognized as invasive species. The Alaska Board of Game unanimously refused to legalize TNR just last November (I was there). Two years from now I and my colleagues will return to propose reclassifying Felis catus as a deleterious exotic species. Should be successfully convince the Board, the result will be year-round, unlimited open season on them via any legal hunting method anywhere it’s legal to hunt in my state. Give me a mailing address and I’ll send you some cat-pelts.

              • The domestic cat is classified as ‘non-native’ on my research. That is not the same as invasive.

                Srce: Alaska Natural Heritage Program.

                Alaska is living in the 19th century isn’t it? Sort of backward mentality. The Wild West. Pick up trucks, bibles, god-fearing and firearms.

              • I presume Jayne Cobb is a pseudonym taken from the fictional character. It is not a true male name. More BS I guess. Afraid to tell us your real name.

      • @ Pretoria Aria why are ye even here other than to post ye muck,I have been involved with TNR in my community for years and my own personal feral colony which was 17 cats when I started have dwindled down to 7 cats since the others died of natural causes or unfortunately were hit by cars so take ye opinion and yeself and go away and BTW it must be ye doing the thumbs down.

    • I put the count at hundreds for my in-laws and their treatment of domestic pets and livestock.
      I asked my FIL one day as he loved on a cat that clearly loved him how he could let it roam and he said in his sweet voice. When this one goes another will come along. The words of a monster in my opinion.

    • It’s obvious he doesn’t care about their well being. I wonder whether he even feeds them. Working cats do a better job on a full tummy. Catching rodents is more along the line of fun for them rather than survival.

  4. Thank you so much for writing this. I was one of the people that commented on his remarks on this particular site. I had so much I wanted to say but just couldn’t form the right thoughts. I wanted to say to him that his remarks were completely ignorant and that he was stupid but I knew that wouldn’t be helpful.

    • He is applying backward logic. He starts with his hate of cats and goes from there to justify it. Facts are then twisted to fit his hatred.
      Facts often left out of these debates include all cats are domestic. Any kitten taken from a feral environment in time can and will turn into a pillow hugging sunbeam hog in your living room. The same cannot be said about a wild animal. They will all revert to their wild instincts. There is a distinct difference in how we treat our domestic pets and vermin isn’t one of them. Domestic pet populations run a muck when humans fail to control the population. S/N has totally eliminated the debacle we see daily with feral cats and shelters full of dogs and cats waiting their turn for the needle. No longer is there a need for anyone to ‘ let nature take it’s course’ or play dunkies to control the local populations instead as one poster here demonstrates there is a significant population in first world countries that are willing to run through the bushes like animals themselves to kill a domestic pet that had no say in it’s situation.
      Worse these troglodytes often marry and reproduce and then pass on this defective thinking to the next generation.
      Just once I would love to see one of these cat hating idiots unleash that vitriol on the people who are causing the issue rather than those of us that are trying to mitigate it.
      You probably won’t. This is the exact type of person who is likely part of the problem. They certainly aren’t part of the solution.

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