I Understand Why Declawing Is Done

Thank you for talking such a lot of sense.

If I was a cat,I too would rather take my chances outdoors than live a long boring un-natural life cooped up without toe ends and possibly doped on drugs too. What life is that ?

People who have cats declawed seem to have lost sight of the fact that cats are born with claws because they need claws.

The number of times I've heard 'but indoor cats don't need claws' shocks me ! Those people obviously don't know the first thing about cats, it's just that they want to 'own' them.

Yes it's primararily vets to blame but I can't think that if our vets had started telling people to keep their cats indoors and then encouraged them to have have them declawed, they'd have got a very good reaction!

I don't know of a single person in the UK, including our vets and their staff, who hasn't been shocked and appalled that it happens, it's so unthinkable to us to get a cat and not like that he has claws.

It would be like us having a child and not accepting he will be our responsibilty just as he comes, good or bad, healthy or unhealthy.

We accept our cats as we do our children, just as they come.

I find it very interesting that in a country such as England, where declawing is so strongly condemned, it is evidently also much more common to let pet cats outdoors. The American veterinary community has done MUCH to discourage the practice of allowing pet cats outdoors. It is of course true that a cat kept indoors will be much safer and often live a longer life as a result. However, when American vets began hammering this into their clients' heads, they FAILED to provide the necessary education about normal feline scratching behavior and how to cope with it that MUST accompany the recommendation for an exclusively indoor life. This is an unnatural existence for a cat, and it is prevalent in this country largely because of the persistence of vets in recommending it. And now, not only has declawing become a lucrative source of income for them, but so have medications such as Prozac and other mood altering drugs. The vets have created the problem with one hand and provided the ILLUSION of a "solution" with the other. But I know that if I were a cat, I would much prefer to take my chances outdoors than sacrifice all my toes in order to have a home.

That is truly upsetting badmouthing UK folk like that Nancy man.Whatever set you off saying such dreadful stuff about us?

Is it because you think we have no right telling folk how wrong declawing is?

It was real hurtful what you wrote man.

I hope youve changed your mind now about declawing and about how we care about our cats and birds.

I agree that nobody has the right to criticise a cat catching a bird if they eat birds themselves.

I eat nothing that had a face man as it would be like eating a brother or a sister.

Ed

Here you are Nancy, here is the evidence that declawing is evil.

All you need to do is copy and paste thsese links

And you claim to understand why someone would do this to their cat?

I've just read your post Nancy. I've also read all the comments and clearly what stands out is how passionate we all are about de-clawing.

Personally I would rather live in the UK where its accepted that cats roam free rather than a barbaric country where cats are treated as fair game for being shot at or burned alive in a cage if they are let out.

And the alternative? Oh yes cats are to be thankful for being saved from a horrific death on the streets; they pay with a life of imprisonment; not being left to roam their keepers house intact, no they pay with their dear claws. They get to become living, breathing stuffed toys; unable to stretch, play, climb or defend themselves.

In answer to your comments if our cats are injured we take them to the vet. We vaccinate against disease and we use drops on the back of the neck for parasites. What do some Americans do? Oh yes mutilate a healthy cat then drop it off at the nearest shelter to be euthanised. How dare you lecture us Brits about 'natural' there's nothing 'natural' about a cat with no claws.

For Gods sake read some of the awful articles on this website; look at some of the pictures of cats clearly suffering from shock after being declawed. Look at those dear neccasery little toes just cut off and discarded. Look at the blood.

No one in their right mind would say (and I quote) 'I understand why declawing is done'

I for one will never understand it.

Your vet doesn't advocate declawing you say Nancy,but does he actually do it?Some vets say they don't like doing it but still do it.

Why????

And if he says Bix has 'castrata syndrome' which as far as I can see doesn't even exist in cats, but if it does then why are some vets castrating kittens very young and not waiting until they are 5/6 months old as is the best time?

It doesn't make sense, but then again nor does declawing.

The best way to help is to boycott without exception any vet who declaws cats.

The message might sink in that way.

Nancy,

Re-read your original post and the aggresive claims that you made regarding how we encourage our cats early death, decimated bird population etc etc.

It then seems rather pathetic to me to say 'don't rag on me, I'm 63.'

So, you've had adequate time to educate yourself on the points that you raise.

We love cats, we love keeping them and keeping them lithe and healthy, attack our care or our pets and you feel the full wrath of our collective devotion.

Please get Bix some exercise and reduce his food intake and build him a catio. This will save your precious furnishings as he will be able to run around and explore and hopefully unwind his coiled spring of frustration at being kept in a prison for however many years.

I too would like to know if you eat birds. If you do you are a hyporcrite, a cat isn't as it is an Obligate carnivore - designed to eat meat.

Ruth is right,you did openly accuse us of wishing an early death on our cats,after all sorts of diseases and perils!

Also that we couldn't give a damn about our garden birds.

You should see us rescuing baby birds thrown out of nests.

You really don't know the half of what people do here for all creatures.

At present I have 14 rescue cats and we 3 ladies(Babz,Ruth and I)built them a run because of course I can't let 14 run free,especially the ones abused before they came to me.

https://pictures-of-cats.org/we-built-a-cat-run.html

My cats come first last and in the middle as do Babz and Ruths cats too.

I hope you have changed your views on English people as it's very hurtful that you condemned us as you did.

I too hope Bix stays trouble free.

Hello again Nancy, I've had my say and so has everyone else and I think you yourself know at the bottom of you that there is NO excuse EVER to declaw a cat.
Sorry if what I and the other 'troops' said upset you but you upset us first by your attack on the care of our cats and by implying that we don't care about birds.
However I'm only here today to tell you that Bix isn't trying to sharpen his claws,he's trying to exercise his muscles,which is what cats do.
They dig in their claws to stretch their leg, shoulder,stomach and back muscles.
It's a pitiful sight seeing declawed cats trying to do that and this being unable to exercise as well as the cats altered walk are what cause arthritis.
I only want to say that I've heard of some cases where the poor cats have tried so hard to do this exercising that they have developed calluses on their stumps and some have actually worn away the skin on the stumps to expose the bone.
I'm not trying to scare you Nancy, just PLEASE keep a close eye on Bix that he doesn't end up like that, especially as he's a big boy.
I don't enjoy this quest to let the whole world know how cruel declawing is,I had a life before I took it on.
I hope and pray your Bix is one of the rare lucky ones who never has any problems from his amputations.
X for his furry head.
I do honestly love and care about every cat in this world.

Thank you, Nancy, for the clarification. I did find the references you mentioned; however, none I found related to felines (or animals in general), which is what made me suspect.

The bloggers on this site are very very passionate about cats, to the point of expressing very heated responses. I am as guilty as the next, depending on the issue at hand and my general mood at the moment. None of us apologize for that, as we care so deeply and, believe it or not, see life through a cat's eyes.

My stray, male tuxedo who visits each morning to be fed is abnormally large as well, yet he is all muscle. He barrels through my legs if I'm not fast enough putting the dish down and even swiped at me once for being too slow. When he did that, I gave him a stern 'talking to' - imitating a cat's irritated vocalization and he's never done it again. Instead he purrs LOUDLY, head butts my legs, loves to be scratched about the head and waits a bit before eating should there be a chance of affection being lavished his way. I understand what you say about large cats being like a bull in a china shop. It was not my intent to accuse you of mistreating your cat; only to be aware of health issues should your cat be fat. Since that is not the case here, I applaud you for the care given; however, it does sound like he's a bit bored. He wants your attention...every play hide-and-seek with him? Or chase me mommie 'cuz I bet I can hide better? Bix sounds like he needs at least a full hour every day of big exercise to calm him down. Good luck with that! Been there, done that.

Please do not feel that you need to shy away from the forum just because of a difference of opinion. This forum is dedicated to cats and the education of the populace in relation to cats. Sometimes the discussion gets heated - so what? That's part and parcel of debate - the end result being education. We may never agree on everything; however, unnecessary procedures like declawing will always rile those of us who know it for what it truly is...animal abuse. Period.

Is there a way for Bix to experience the outdoors to work off steam? Another poster here, Finn Frode, just moved to a wonderful home with a garden. He constructed a 'catio' for his felines to enjoy the outdoors without the dangers. Look it up - the photos are great! I used to have a similar setup in my old apartment, but the current one is impossible to replicate. Now, I'm trying to figure out how to make an indoor playhouse for my Sadie to keep her amused, while keeping the integrity of the unit (and the landlord satisfied).

Castrata, or Castrati, Syndrome is a hormonal growth disturbance syndrome that is never seen anymore- at least, not in people. I've only seen refernces to it in Church music histories. It used to be observed in some of the little boys who were castrated for service as sopranos/tenors by the church in Italy. Many were castrated over the centuries but few developed the syndrome, which is marked by extreme height at (what would have been) puberty(some were more than 7 feet tall)and supposedly, exceptionally sweet voices. The vet I see (he doesn't advocate declawing, either) said that it's only occasionally seen in castrated male animals who were neutered VERY young- and like I said, I think, Bix may just be a naturally, not abnormally, big cat. He isn't any particular breed- an ordinary (though large) male tabby. He jumps from the floor to windowsills that are 5 feet off the ground- is slowly destroying a caned chair back with his obviously not TOO sensitive paws, sharpening his non-existent claws- and runs through the house like a charging rhino, smackin into my shins, daring me to play chase-and-hide. He sees the vet regularly. He crouches on my chest and pats my face when he thinks he's being ignored. He's not fat- he could lose a pound, but he's within range for his size. (And nor does he have a very sweet voice...) I don't mistreat my cat, or any cat I've ever had.

Nancy, as an afterthought from my last post, the myth about cats with claw decimating the bird population...that, too, is hogwash.

My little stray/feral colony out back is hysterical. The cats feed from their dish each morning while the birds sit on the railing no more than a couple feet above the cats, just waiting and hoping that some kibble might be left over for them to pounce on. A squirrel also sits on the end of the same rail for the same reason and life goes on its merry way. In the winter, I do put out bird feeding stations, along with squirrel food and continual cat food. All of these animals feed together, the birds chatter and tease the squirrel and they play chase while the cats just sit there watching the entire scenario, not attacking them but just curiously watching them. The only time the cats swipe at the birds or squirrel is if any of them have the audacity of trying to steal cat food, be it wet or dry, before the cats finish their own meal. I'd say our bird population has remained in tact, thank you.

To be fair, I tried looking up the terminology of "castrata syndrome" in relation to cats or any other application...it doesn't exist. I started with PetMD, followed by various animal-related sites, ending with a general search of the entire Internet. Your vet has given you a load of HOOEY! The closest I could come was 'castrato' which relates to castration, but that's it.

To be absolutely fair, what breed is your Bix? Is he huge by breed, or is he just fat? If he's fat, I'd suggest a strict diet with exercise before he develops diabetes, heart problems or any host of ailments.

As you can see, I am from the USA, have been an animal lover as long as I've breathed (almost 58 years now), care for a 16-year tortie with thyroid issues, volunteer at our local animal shelter, look after a feral/stray colony at home and still would NEVER EVER advocate declawing - no excuses, no bullshit, NEVER!!!

Here in Massachusetts, we recently passed laws about animal abuse, including but not limited to, banning devocalization of animals (usually cats and dogs), animal abuse of any kind is now a felony (as it should've been years ago), domestic violence laws now include pets (included in restraining orders) - just to name a few. We have a groundswell movement here also about banning declawing too! My vet absolutely forbids declawing and encourages his staff to educate the public about declawing when the mutilation is requested. He won't even refer people to other vets who do the alleged 'procedure' as he feels it is beyond inhuman to do so. He truly lives by the oath of 'do no harm.'

Our shelter also will not allow anyone to declaw a cat or dog and if they find out that an adopter had the procedure done, they confiscate the animal, which they can do since the adopter signs a contract agreeing to the conditions before approval. Our shelter also sees declawed cats come in on a regular basis, since the human doesn't understand why their cat's personality changed so drastically. Gee whiz...it's not brain surgery - it's mutilation! How would you feel if someone grabbed you, held you down, anesthetized you (or not), then lopped off all of you finger and toe joints??? You'd be pretty depressed too, I would imagine.

If you witnessed this surgery as you say you have and the vet did a 'partial' declaw, then that vet should be in jail! There is no such thing. I believe Ruth said it succinctly - no need for me to elaborate. That vet botched the surgery and I wonder if the cat ever recovered.

Do yourself a favor, Nancy - go through PoC's blog and read every single thread about declawing and watch the very vivid videos of the surgery and its aftermath. If you can do that and STILL think declawing is acceptable under any circumstance (even if you would never do it yourself), I would suggest counselling.

Nancy, it's a myth that declawing guarantees a cat a home for life otherwise it wouldn't be possible to adopt one from a shelter. Did you know that the HSUS estimate that to date, declawing has generated in excess of 13 Billion US$ of additional revenue for vets? Money is the main motivation for them continuing to promote the cruel and unnecessary amputation of healthy toes. Declawing doesn't save lives, it ruins them, and vets should not allow themselves to be emotionally blackmailed into mutilating cats for the convenience of selfish people. Having a cat is not a legal requirement, so anyone who can't accept that cats have claws shouldn't adopt one.

People in favour of declawing like to delude themselves they are "rescuing" that cat, but that's just arrogance to assume that because they can't cope with claws that no-one else can.

You may have lived in other countries, but I'm taking a guess that England (or any of the other UK countries) wasn't one of them. If it were, you would have experienced for yourself that compared to other countries, it's a relatively safe environement for cats to go outside. Vets and rescue organisations in the UK consider that the indoor-only lifestyle is best suited to blind, deaf, elderly or FIV positive cats, preferring to rehome young and healthy cats to someone who can promise the cat access to a garden. The vast majority of cats in the UK live into their late teens or early twenties, and there are even feral cats as old as 28 on record.

I lived in an apartment for several years with the two ex-feral cats I adopted from the streets. Neither of them ever scratched anything indoors, because they had scratch items in every room. Part of their desire to scratch is to mark territory, so they need to have scratchers in different locations and multi-cat household shouldn't expect their cats to share one or two scratch items for the same reason. Indoor cats need to be provided with outlets for natural behaviour such as hunting. Cat food doesn't provide them with the opportunities for tearing and shredding that they would get from hunting, so they need at least 30 minutes interactive playtime every day in which to attack and "kill" toys. It's when cats are bored that they get into mischief because they are looking for ways to amuse themselves.

You seem to be assuming that all cats like hunting birds, which simply isn't true. In the UK the RSPB state there is no scientific evidence to suggest that predation by cats is having any impact on bird numbers. Unlike the Audoban Society, the RSPB are honest enough to admit that loss of natural habitat, food sources and climate changes are the real causes of declining bird species.

What I don't understand is why a minority group (the pro-declawers) are allowed to get away with such a wicked act of animal cruelty in modern, civilised countries such as the USA and Canada.

Nancy, it's a myth that declawing guarantees a cat a home for life otherwise it wouldn't be possible to adopt one from a shelter. Did you know that the HSUS estimate that to date, declawing has generated in excess of 13 Billion US$ of additional revenue for vets? Money is the main motivation for them continuing to promote the cruel and unnecessary amputation of healthy toes. Declawing doesn't save lives, it ruins them, and vets should not allow themselves to be emotionally blackmailed into mutilating cats for the convenience of selfish people. Having a cat is not a legal requirement, so anyone who can't accept that cats have claws shouldn't adopt one.

People in favour of declawing like to delude themselves they are "rescuing" that cat, but that's just arrogance to assume that because they can't cope with claws that no-one else can.

You may have lived in other countries, but I'm taking a guess that England (or any of the other UK countries) wasn't one of them. If it were, you would have experienced for yourself that compared to other countries, it's a relatively safe environement for cats to go outside. Vets and rescue organisations in the UK consider that the indoor-only lifestyle is best suited to blind, deaf, elderly or FIV positive cats, preferring to rehome young and healthy cats to someone who can promise the cat access to a garden. The vast majority of cats in the UK live into their late teens or early twenties, and there are even feral cats as old as 28 on record.

I lived in an apartment for several years with the two ex-feral cats I adopted from the streets. Neither of them ever scratched anything indoors, because they had scratch items in every room. Part of their desire to scratch is to mark territory, so they need to have scratchers in different locations and multi-cat household shouldn't expect their cats to share one or two scratch items for the same reason. Indoor cats need to be provided with outlets for natural behaviour such as hunting. Cat food doesn't provide them with the opportunities for tearing and shredding that they would get from hunting, so they need at least 30 minutes interactive playtime every day in which to attack and "kill" toys. It's when cats are bored that they get into mischief because they are looking for ways to amuse themselves.

You seem to be assuming that all cats like hunting birds, which simply isn't true. In the UK the RSPB state there is no scientific evidence to suggest that predation by cats is having any impact on bird numbers. Unlike the Audoban Society, the RSPB are honest enough to admit that loss of natural habitat, food sources and climate changes are the real causes of declining bird species.

What I don't understand is why a minority group (the pro-declawers) are allowed to get away with such a wicked act of animal cruelty in modern, civilised countries such as the USA and Canada.

My family are British and American, and we are all appalled at the practice of declawing cats. It has become the norm without people really understanding how cruel it really is. It is so sad.

I beg to disagree,it was smart of you to post here Nancy as you are now educated as to the truth about declawing and why it should never be done.

You have also learned that cats in our country are loved,respected,cared for as family and enjoy their rights.

No need to be nasty you say!!!

I've just been catching up on your post and the comments and see you came on here and insulted us in the UK making us out not to care a damn about our cats or our bird population.

You condemn our cats to disease and early death and wonder why people retaliated.

What kind of a vet do you patronise who tells you Bix was castrated too early and you believe him.

A declaw one more than likely who won't admit that declawed cats can't exercise to keep fit and trim.

A lot of people have arthritis,it happens to humans.Declawed cats have arthritis deliberately caused by declawing.

Watch over Bix and get him treatment from a GOOD vet,that is of course one who doesn't cripple cats.

BTW I too would love to know if you eat birds yourself ???

Just to be clear Nancy, there is ONLY one way to declaw cats, so the vet you say removed ONLY the claw and tendon totally botched the job and caused all the cats he declawed even more untold pain and misery than a 'normal' declawing.

The claw is embedded into bone,that bone contains claw cells and if that bone along with the cells is not removed then the claw grows back crookedly and painfully.

Then you say neither vet would declaw a cat after 3 months old, is that supposed to be a good thing?Declawing is SUPPOSED to be a last resort procedure done for very serious scratching behaviour not to young kittens.

Some vets advertise neuter/declaw packages or give discounts on declawing to encourage people to have their kitten disabled rather than train him to a scratching post.

That can't be right can it ? That a person who took an oath to harm no animal encourages lazy selfish people to get a kitten knowing they can have his toe ends removed for convenience.

Laser declawing is being pushed now, it makes lots of money for those vets, but it's still the amputation of the last toe joints.

I'm 63 also and a retired vet nurse (tech in your language)and I'd have chopped my own fingers off rather than assist at the amputation of ten healthy parts of a cat. But even before it was banned our vets would never abuse cats that way.

So if you aren't against us(apart from the terrible way you reckon we treat our cats)then you must be for us, so prove it, sign our petition and pass it on.

Sorry Nancy, you're a bigotted fool and far from impressing us with your comments about declawing you show that you haven't a clue. I would be mortally ashamed to have a pudgy and huge cat, I certainly wouldn't be writing about him, I'd be getting off my backside and making some fun and games for him to help him get some weight off. Letting a declawed cat put weight on is neglectful, he will suffer from this neglect as he gets older.

You have the wrong impression of cats enjoying the freedom they are entitled to, because those of us who care for not only the physical but also the mental wellbeing of our cats understand that they need access to fresh air and the stimulation of outdoors, even if only via a cat run or catio. Looking after them so that they do not become subject to injury, disease, poisoning or parasites is all part of proper cat care. As for decimating the bird population - are YOU a vegetarian?

Come on, folks, no reason to be nasty and insulting. Read this closely- I wouldn't declaw a cat! I've never declawed a cat, or had it done- though many many (30+)years ago, working for a couple of vets, I witnessed the surgery. One did the toe-joint removal type of surgery, the other removed only claw and tendon, and neither would do it after the cat was 3 months old. Even now, few vets in the US refuse to do the surgery, reckoning that in a country where hundreds of MILLIONS of kittens are euthanised every year, losing claws and optimising adoption is a much lesser evil. It's Hobbs Choice, but I see their point. I AM NOT ADVOCATING DECLAWING. It is worth pointing out that here in the states, telling your vet you let the cat roam outside will earn you a sharp 30 minute lecture on owner responsibilities.

It's not fair to rag on me like I'm serving chopped cat in my enchiladas. I'm almost 63; I've had cats that stayed indoors, I've had cats that went in and out, and just reading the (almost) uniformly nasty replies I got, it's obvious that I'm not the only cat owner to have had very uneven results in scratching post training, though some find it easy to shrug off, once again, as 'natural'. And it's not just unkind, it's rather stupid to tell me that I can't call myself a cat lover because I had poor luck training some of my cats - and then insult my poor Bix! Bix is an enormous neutered male- he weighs almost 25 lbs and, the vet tells me, was probably neutered too early and has "castrata syndrome"- or maybe he's just a big cat. Cats this size are not all that unusual. He's only a couple of pounds over optimum weight, gets lots of exercise, and has no arthritis. I'm the one with the arthritis. Probably from lugging that cat around.

I'll always have a cat, or maybe more than one. I'll never declaw one. Rescue doesn't make me feel saintly, it makes me feel practical! I begin to think, though, that posting here wasn't the smartest thing I ever did...

You are wrong.Our cats aren't a bit less destructive indoors because they are free to go out.They are not destructive at all.

The reason for that is that from being kittens or from first coming to us in the case of older cats,they are kindly and gently shown how to use scratching materials.

Cats are highly intelligent,more so than some people!

A cat happy with scratching places of its own doesn't need to scratch elsewhere even when no one is at home.

Your possessions got scratched,that means you failed your cats badly.They were probably bored to tears in their prison.

Your remarks about our decimated bird population and cats with... to quote you...injury, disease, poisoning, parasites, all of which cat-keepers in the UK are happy to have their pets subjected to -because it's "natural".That's right- all that's natural.So is early death.....

I think you should look to your own failings,can you not see it's YOUR cat doomed to an early death from heart failure poor creature after a life of disablement,boredom trapped indoors and carrying excess weight you mismame 'pudgy'

He may have been declawed when you got him but you took on his welfare and owe it to him to take care of his health.

It's natural for cats to have claws you know.So I don't understand why you understand it's done.

Did someone in the UK upset you that you are filled with venom for us or are you just crazed with jealousy that we are able to give our cats the best life they deserve?

What tommy rot! There Nancy,you like slang so that's a bit more for you,it means the same as bullshit or bollocks only it's more ladylike to say.

Of course you can train your cats not to scratch the furniture even when no one is home.

It only takes a little time and patience after providing them with lots of furniture of their own.

You are probably one of the squirt them with water brigade if they do'wrong' and don't know you should never punish cats,most especially for natural behaviour.

What a weak futile argument you present and you know it too because you go on to attack the very people who give their cats the best life they can.

Weary old misconceptions like the decimation of birds by cats are sooooo boring as is your attack on a country with the best animal welfare in the world.

Look to your own house Nancy and your pudgy cat and see the cat with the prospect of a shortened life because he is overweight and facing even more health hazards than other declawed cats do.

I'm amazed you boast of his pudginess as if it's a good thing!

You are seriously ignorant Nancy so don't expect us to be in any way convinced by your spiteful ramblings.

Nancy,you really should have got counselling for your upholstery,vinyl flooring,plastered walls, and feather bed pillows as they may all have had PTSD(post traumatic scratching disorder)poor things.

We all know how much pain and distress inanimate objects feel,so much more than living feeling cats do.

You say didn't love your cats any less for ruining your much loved suffering objects,but you didn't love their claws did you.

Well dear lady,those claws are part and parcel of cats,they come equipped with them because they need them.

All real lovers of cats know that and love those healthy neccessary claws.So pardon me if I can't picture you as a real cat lover.

How come you understand why declawing is done?Does that mean you understand that people not fit to own cats are entitled to pay a corrupt vet to cripple them for life?

Does that mean those unfortunate cats deserve to be crippled because of your understanding?

Get real,it's YOU talking bullshit or bollocks or whatever term you want to use in your desire to force your misguided views on us.

According to you my "disease ridden doomed to early death bird murderers" are badly treated. hah I think they would disagree and rather live their lives in our country than the life the poor trapped toeless overweight unhealthy cats like your very own Bix have to live.

If I was a cat I'd choose to live the life I was born to live in England rather than the risk of falling into the hands of a person like you in the USA.

Life is to be lived and living is doing what you were born to do.In the case of cats,it's not to sit toeless,overweight and bored,looking longingly out of the window as life passes you by while your owner bows and scrapes to her very important furniture.

You took on a disabled cat so look after him,make him as happy as is possible for the poor little soul.

Look at his stumps,think what you are saying in that you can understand why people do this.

Bix is a cripple Nancy,just as you would be if you lost your finger ends.

Instead of your blethering bullshit on here you ought to be playing with poor pudgy Bix for his exercise as he is destined to crippling arthritis in his joints which will cancel out the good deed you did by adopting a disabled cat.

He is doomed to arthritis anyway because of the declawing but being overweight will certainly make it much more severe.

Coming to fight a losing battle,thinking you can convince any of the good people who frequent these pages that declawuing is acceptable sometimes is just silly.

You don't have a leg to stand on,you talk bollocks or bullshit(whichever you choose although I'd say a load of rubbish)and think you know everything about the entire world because you've lived in more than one country.

It sounds like you want kudos for adopting rescue cats,well I've got news for you,all of us do that and many of us also volunteer in animal rescue offline and online too.

So don't try to teach your grannie to suck eggs.

Cats are very very easy to train to scratching posts,if you couldn't leave the house for a while without your precious furniture being ruined then you failed those cats.

Cats get bored,more so those poor things that never see light of day outside.

What life is that????I'd say bad enough without sitting with no toes also and facing God knows what consequences from that being done.

Declawing is CRUEL

Declawing is UNECCESSARY

Declawing MUST BE STOPPED everywhere

In 38 countries declawing is either banned or considered extremely inhumane and not done,along with some cities in California which banned it too.Are all these people wrong Nancy?Do you know better than them?

In your own words Bix is"a pudgy,HUGE neutered male"

Poor poor cat trapped in with no means of exercise,overweight and destined for joint problems if not heart problems from his weight.

In our country,yes the one you so scathingly dismiss,you could be prosecuted for failing in your duty to care for Bix as he should be.

Yes Nancy,we have a Pet Welfare law here which is to protect cats and to make sure every cat(and other pets)live their lives as fitting to their species.Overweight cats are at risk and you'd have to do something about it instead of boasting as if it's a good thing.

Does Bix have ANY access to outside?OK you may live in a place not safe to let cats out,if so why haven't you built some sort of safe enclosure like others have?

You'll find pages about that here on Micheal's PoC.

There is no excuse to deprive a cat of his claws or of his natural need for fresh air and exercise.

Do you grow Kitty Grass for him?Cats need to nibble on grass for their digestion,oh but you know so much you must know that.

I have a houseful of happy HEALTHY children,HEALTHY happy cats and dogs with no diseases or parasites or any other stuff you think we let our cats suffer in England.

And we have lots of birds in our garden.

Answer me this please...do you eat chicken or turkey?They are birds too you know,so don't throw the old chestnut of cats decimating the bird population at us.HEALTHY birds die horribly for food and this is done for people who don't need to eat flesh.Cats only catch the weakest birds.

So your furniture got scratched..SHOCK..HORROR.. oh the poor furniture was it in pain?

Like the pain cats suffer during and after declawing?

Cats are feeling creatures Nancy,just like you ...hmmm..maybe not like you as you have no feelings for cats do you or you wouldn't condone their mutilation.

You understand why people would have a cat declawed because you're obviously of a mindset leaning that way yourself, you list the things that cats have scratched in your home as though it makes you a martyr to have put up with it and though you say you "probably" wouldn't declaw a cat and certainly not an adult cat this is a long, long way from saying you will NEVER declaw a cat, so you're open to the possibilty that one day you may decide to pay someone to amputate a kitten's toes for your convenience. This makes you every bit as bad as the rest of the USA mob who think it is acceptable to rob cats of vital parts of their bodies even though in any other country they would be prosecuted for animal abuse for doing so!

How strange that you feel the need to attack those of us who provide our cats with a healthy indoor/outdoor life, you have a funny idea of how cats in England are cared for. You seem to have a vision of our cats staggering about injured, poisoned and raddled with disease with several birds hanging out of their mouths. Wake up Nancy,don't believe all the guff you are fed by the press, or to use your own word that is Bollocks!

Finally, you need to keep an eye on Bix, his enforced indoor life has abviously led to obesity which in itself is bad enough but the fact that he is declawed and overweight means he is wide open to arthritis and joint problems as he gets older.

In other words before you start patronising other people with your "understanding" you need to pay some attention to your own cat husbandry.

You obviously think you own cats as possessions and that being shut in with no access to fresh air,sunshine and grass is more natural than our cats living the life they were meant to live.
I think you need to have a really good session reading all the articles about declawing on PoC,also look at the pictures of suffering cats and you will find out that you didn't really have a clue about the reality of declawing.
You desperately need to hone up on your knowledge before coming here again and challenging those of us who have taken the trouble to make sure what we say is correct.

Then you can sign our petition too along with the thousands of other people from all over the world who want this abuse of cats stopped once and for all.

Nancy in your own words you are talking bullshit !

Also you'll find that the more educated of us in the UK don't use the word bollocks.

If you need to resort to slang language to make your statement, then I for one am not impressed.

Declawing is NEVER justifiable, if you can't train a cat not to scratch your furniture then you should not have a cat, it's as simple as that.

You say you 'probably' wouldn't declaw a cat and certainly not an adult cat, so does that mean you WOULD deprive a little kitten of his toe ends JUST INCASE he scratched ? Do you know that declawing is so painful to the cat that it takes the strength of pain medication given to terminally ill cancer patients to dull that pain ?

You don't say if Bix has problems ....yet ....

You do know I hope that he is almost 100% sure to suffer painful arthritis as he ages.Keep a close eye on him as also even years after declawing, problems can arise with claw regrowth or bone splinters.

Declawed cats can't exercise their muscles, scratching is NOT bad behaviour, it's necessary behaviour.

You obviously didn't try all the different sorts of scratching posts and pads until you found the one your cats prefered and you obviously hadn't the patience to teach your cats to use them.

There is no such thing as a bad cat but there are bad cat 'owners' A good cat caretaker (as we are here) would never ever contemplate having their cat disabled even if it was legal.

I take exception to your remark about our UK cats facing all sorts of perils outside, do you think we open the door, let them out and forget about them? You couldn't be more wrong. Our cats are neutered and kept up to date with everything possible to prevent illness,parasites, etc.

We have cat friendly homes our cats love to come back to and we always keep an eye out for them, we never leave them out all night or when we go out.

We are a cat loving nation with cat friendly gardens and welfare laws for our cats protection.

36 years of long living happy fulfilled cats in my own family says how well we care for our cats here.

It's you who lives in a country where people pay someone to mutilate their cats for them for convenience sake .....

As for decimating birds, people do more to decimate birds than cats ever could !

Read Michael's article on that, you might learn something.

A bit more to follow ........

Nancy, you should be completely ashamed of yourself. To say that you cannot train a cat to stop scratching furniture is a failing on your part- you are a poor animal trainer - your cat us behaving absolutely as naturally as it should. Newborn babies often scratch themselves, would you advocate ripping their nails out too or would you place them in anti scratch mittens to train out the behaviour?

I've had many cats and only 1 had a problem with scratch post training and that was only because he was a rescue cat who was feral and the mother died. I took him in and slowly and patiently socialised him but naturally, he had some behaviour problems due to his poor start in life. I was very lucky in most respects though because he fed well, litter trained wonderfully well, was gentle if shy with humans and only briefly struggled with clawing furniture but this happens with cats.

If you have no aptitude for training or patience to withstand what is essentially acceptable feline behaviour don't get a cat. Save the cats for the sensible and kind owners like Michael who know what they are talking about. He thinks you are brave to express your views whereas I just think you are downright cruel and shouldn't be able to keep animals.

Nancy, It sounds like your cats are bored, or perhaps stressed so they do a lot of destroying your furniture floors, etc.

I purchased a one year old retired show cat a couple of years ago, and when she arrived she would rip and tear everything in sight. I purchased a really large and sturdy cat post covered in sisal carpet, and put the tape strips where she had been clawing to discourage her behaviour.

She no longer claws anywhwere whether I am at home or not, she does really use her post, and in fact when I tell her what a good girl she is when I see her at her post, she really goes to town!

I have never met a cat who couldn't be trained, but they are not dogs and you have to understand them. Faith decided she didn't want her claws trimmed and would put up a good fight, so I decided that treats were very important to her I would clip one nail a day, and immediately give her one of her favorite treats. After a couple of days she got it, and now lets me trim all of her nails, and then runs to the kitchen where I keep her treats. Problem solved.....cats will always try to outsmart you, you just have to show them whats in it for them and they will do what you want them to do.

Hi Nancy, thanks for sharing your ideas. You are brave to air your views here as we are a group of people who detest declawing.

I am afraid that your arguments do not hold water. If you don't like scratched furniture and can't train a cat to use a scratching post, don't adopt a cat - simple. The answer is not to declaw for your convenience.

Secondly you are saying that UK cats die younger than American cats because we keep indoor/outdoor cats and Americans frequently keep indoor only cats. There is no evidence to support that statement. In fact there are reasons why indoor cats might have a shorter life; stress due to unnatural lifestyle being one reason. But there is no evidence to support any ideas on this.

There is also no evidence that outdoor cats decimate bird populations. I don't like it when people peddle this myth that is promoted by bird conservationists. The evidence is simply not there as cats prey mostly on ground living creatures as they are easier to catch. See:

Domestic Cats Do Not Decimate Bird Populations

I feel that your arguments are shallow and ill conceived. But they are typical of many Americans who justify declawing. There is no way that it can be justified as it is wrong on a commonsense and moral basis. This is obvious to all right minded people.